View source for Talk:Best Foods

== Certain changes won't stick ==
I noticed that there were a few foods that were showing as x.5 (point five) but the math should have shown them to be x.25 (point two-five). I made the changes, previewed them and they refuse to change. Can someone more experienced go through and make the changes?
They're: Crimbo(ween) Cookies, savoy truffle ... centipede eggs, hot date ... rat scrapple, and Au Jus Gezund Heit ... Knob sausage. --[[User:Amandakerik|Amandakerik]] 12:24, 17 March 2008 (CDT)

Oh, problem found, it's on my end. Wonky script messed things up. I'll fix what I oopsed on, lesson learned. 
--[[User:Amandakerik|Amandakerik]] 12:50, 17 March 2008 (CDT)

==NS13==

Can we add a column with the level requirement for eating each food?

==.==
Shouldn't White Burger be placed everywhere from 1.5 to 2.5 adv/fullness? --[[User:Yupsi|Yupsi]] 02:17, 16 January 2007 (CST)
* I second this, the adventures, once increased, carry from ascension to ascension...--[[User:Sp8z|Sp8z]] 15:46, 20 March 2007 (CDT)

Needs info for all the new tacos (catgut, goat cheese, jumping bean, pr0n, royal jelly, tofu)  --[[User:ElroyJetson|ElroyJetson]] 15:02, 17 August 2006 (CDT)
*Went ahead and did it myself, based on values in the item pages.  I'll go check the best by stats to make them consistent.  --[[User:ElroyJetson|ElroyJetson]] 15:41, 17 August 2006 (CDT)

Ancient frozen dinner is grouped with stale baguette at 3 fullness, even though it's actually 4.  Figured I'd let you guys know and someone with the know-how can fix it, since I am not such a person.  --[[User:STG|STG]] 00:19, 25 October 2007 (CDT)
*Done and done!  Brushing up on my HTML table editing was quite fun =P --[[User:CheezyBob|CheezyBob]] 14:12, 26 October 2007 (CDT)
----

Needs info for
*Knob lo mein
*spooky lo mein
*olive lo mein
*asparagus lo mein
*Knoll lo mein
*so uh, I guess that would be all the "lo mein's"<BR>
[[User:ColtsScore|ColtsScore]] 22:20, 12 July 2006 (CDT)
:I added them, using just the data available from other pages, without confirming the stats in-game. --[[User:Jonrock|Jonrock]] 14:52, 9 August 2006 (CDT)
*[[Tofurkey Nugget]] needs to be added.--[[User:Rentsy|Rentsy]] 01:16, 13 February 2008 (CST)
-----

needs data for new pies (strawberry, lemon merangue, etc)[[User:Teffania|Teffania]] 07:22, 1 December 2006 (CST)
* Done, based on their stats pages. [[User:Froodian|Froodian]] 12:57, 11 January 2007 (CST)

[[User:Allen_36s|Allen_36s]] 8:03, 25, November 2007
I noticed that the Knob Pasty isn't on the list for Best foods(stats gain) its on the adventures gain.  Going by the information on them should it be 16.5 for the stat gaining - Allen

== Fricasseed brains and Brains casserole ==

Page needs info for both of the above.
--[[User:Cjhard|Cjhard]] 04:43, 3 March 2007 (CST)

== Level ==

Needs a column added for level requirement -

--[[User:DreamTheEndless|DreamTheEndless]] 00:42, 7 July 2007 (CDT)

Level 13+ will never work in Ronin or Hardcore
I edited the page to include the info. If you don't like it, please improve the presentation but don't delete it - so that they don't keep getting bug reports about this know issue. 
Source:
    bmaher (#1052080)
    Date: Thursday, March 12, 2020, 08:19PM
    The message is incorrect, and might not ever be updated.
    Things that require level 13 or higher cannot be consumed in Ronin or Hardcore, no matter what level you are.
--[[User:Random42|Random42]] ([[User talk:Random42|talk]]) 01:36, 13 March 2020 (UTC)

== List of new foods to add ==

Once they've been confirmed somehow and added to the chart, 
remove them from this list.  Spotted a new food?  Add it to the list.
:Here's what I think is missing, based on using [[:# Foods (Ordered by Level Requirement)]] as a complete list:


Perchance could someone add data for the pr0n cocktail when consumed with a silver shrimp fork? Unless I'm mistaken, just going by the data on the item page, the pr0n/fork combo should be around the 2.75 adv/fullness slot... --[[User:Bonkbonk|Bonkbonk]] 01:26, 19 October 2007 (CDT)

Queen Cookie et al have not yet been added --[[User:Mystia|Mystia]] 03:57, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

==Best Diet Tables Revamp==
Many Wiki users have noted on the best diet talk pages ([[Talk:Best Drinks]], [[Talk:Best Foods (adventures)]], [[Talk:Best Foods (stats)]]) that tweaks, most importantly level requirements (in fact, the new foods being added to the [[Best Foods (adventures)]] page currently have levels, and this is creating unsightly cell dangling), should be added in. In an effort to keep the discussion in one place, let's put ideas and comments on this page. --[[User:Bagatelle|Bagatelle]] 16:46, 16 July 2007 (CDT)

:It's causing unsightly cell dangling because I'm not finished yet. Patience and all will be beautiful once more. But if you actually don't like the format that's going in, comment please. UPDATE: Now finished. Huzzah and such. --{{User:Demyx/sig}}


For the table revamps, I think we should break the rowspans, and maybe even enter one food per row rather than comma-delimiting within a class in addition to adding the level requirement (does anyone know whether foods of the same class all have the same level requirement?). We should probably also make the table sortable, but my concern there is that people will be tempted to sort by two variables (level and other) to read it for the best food available at or below their level. I did a test, and apparently table rows can be transcluded, so we can make separate pages for each separate level and then create separate tables for each level that include all equal and lower level requirements. However, I don't know how much of a server load this would cause, the editing previews wouldn't work for transcluded table rows. Perhaps colouring would be a better way to go? I've included an example for people to experiment with below. --[[User:Bagatelle|Bagatelle]] 13:05, 8 July 2007 (CDT)
----
'''Toy Table -- feel free to edit''' (item 5 is transcluded)
{| style="text-align:center" border=1px cellspacing=0 cellpadding=3 class="sorttable" |
! Name
! Level
! Fullness
! Mean Adv
! Mean Stat
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#AAAAAA"
|Item 01 ||10 ||3 ||2 ||2
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#999999"
|Item 02 ||9 ||3 ||1 ||2
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#888888" 
|Item 03 ||8 ||2 ||2 ||2
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#777777" 
|Item 04 ||7 ||3 ||1 ||3
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#666666"
{{:User:Bagatelle/test}}
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#555555"
|Item 06 ||5 ||1 ||7 ||4
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#444444"
|Item 07 ||4 ||5 ||8 ||9
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#333333"
|Item 08 ||3 ||2 ||2 ||3
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#222222"
|Item 09 ||2 ||2 ||1 ||2
|- style="color:#FFFFFF; background:#111111"
|Item 10 ||1 ||5 ||3 ||6
|}
----

== Suspicious values for new foods ==
The lasagnas are listed with an adv/fullness ratio of 5.5 in the table, but on the individual pages, they show a 12-18 adventure output range and fullness of 3.  That's 5.0 adv/fullness if my math is right.  Where did the 5.5 value come from? --[[User:Greycat|Greycat]] 11:32, 9 July 2007 (CDT)

:As near as I can tell, gnat lasagna had a 15-18 range reported early on and was added to the table at that time.  The other two were pasted into the preexisting gnat lasagna entry, and none were updated when more range data was reported.  Moving them down to 5.0. --[[User:Foobar|Foobar]] 22:59, 11 July 2007 (CDT)

Does [[sandwich of the gods]] really average out to 35 adventures?  Looking individual page for it would lead me to believe that the average is 34.5 advs.  If I'm not being stupid with my math, that would mean that either the page for the sandwich needs to be changed or the value on this table.  --[[User:CheezyBob|CheezyBob]] 14:32, 26 October 2007 (CDT)
*It's an issue of rarer foods not having data points. As more people eat them, the range gets nailed down (widened) more accurately. It's more likely that the range on the item page is more (not necessarily totally) correct, as that would be the logical place for more frequent updates. --[[User:Bagatelle|Bagatelle]] 19:34, 26 October 2007 (CDT)

According to the individual pages on the lasagnas they only give 4.83 adv per fullness bumping them down to be equal to the beer basted brat, and super salad. If no one objects to the numbers I'll change this soon. --[[User:Trytoguess|Trytoguess]] 02:13, 7 February 2008 (CST)

== Suspicious values for old foods ==

According to its wiki page, Can-shaped gelatinous cranberry sauce has an adventure range of 9-17, which yields an average of 13 adventures, or 4.333 adv/fullness.  This should move it much higher up the page, n'est pas?  --[[User:Uknowforkids|Uknowforkids]] 08:40, 13 July 2007 (CDT)

[[Hell broth]] is listed as having an average adventure gain of 12 in this table, but the range on its own page is 7-15, an average of 11. Which is right? --[[User:TheArchivist|TheArchivist]] 21:48, 2 October 2007 (CDT)

== Remove deimplemented foods? ==
I think the old Crimbo Cafe foods just clutter up the table, since they will never be consumable again. I will jump in with both feet and remove them later on unless someone has a good reason not to; if someone comes up with a reason after I do it, of course they can revert. [[User:Rebrane|Rebrane]] 08:04, 23 January 2008 (CST)

== wonton adventure isn't right ==
Just looking at the paige for each individual wonton makes it obvious that they are about on pair with the level 15 skill needing goods in terms of adventures.

Somebody ought to edit that.

== Request for someone who is good at this ==
Can someone edit the tables to allow for dynamic sorting?  It would be useful to sort dynamically based on fullness and/or level etc...  I'm not good enough.  --[[User:Codsmack|Codsmack]] 13:21, 8 July 2008 (CDT)

== Pr0n Cocktail ==

Should we have two separate entries for this for both the base adventure/stat gain and the higher adventure/stat gain if eaten with a silver shrimp fork?

Looks like it just has the base on here at present. --[[User:PyroICFF|PyroICFF]] 07:33, 9 July 2008 (CDT)

-

Can someone add the King Cookie, Queen Cookie, Rook Cookie, Bishop Cookie and Knight Cookie - from the rabbit hole chessboard - onto this list?  - AvangionQ / October 2nd, 2010.
*The latter 3 look like they may have incomplete ranges. Are they actually fully spaded? --[[User:Fig bucket|Fig bucket]] 12:13, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

Can someone add the Nanite-infested Fruitcake and Nanite-infested Candy Canes to this list? - AvangionQ / October 2nd, 2010.

== Color code? ==

What the heck do the colors mean? --[[User:Silent Knight|SilentKnight]] 22:38, 14 October 2010 (UTC)
* They're there so you can easily differentiate groups of food by their average adv/full ratio.--[[User:Erich|Erich]] 23:37, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

== This article is way hard to edit ==

Is there any chance we can use crazy complicated templates like the functions available at [http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Extension:ParserFunctions] ? Adjusting SPAN attributes every time you add something gets annoying. --[[User:Silent Knight|SilentKnight]] 23:37, 14 October 2010 (UTC)
*[[Discussion#Reworking item data pages for consumables|I'm working]] on getting some changes pushed through that would make it much easier.  And I don't think those particular parser functions are of use; but we do have some fancy table functionalities these days, and with the changes I'm trying to get done those should combine to make this page extremely easy to deal with.  That's the hope, anyway.  --[[User:Flargen|Flargen]] 23:55, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

Ooooh, that looks far better than what I was looking at! yeah forget that mediawiki stuff I asked about. Flargen you are amazing. --[[User:Silent Knight|SilentKnight (#119812)]] 00:45, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

== Hobo Market Consumables ==

Any reason this table doesn't have the hobo market food? 74 net advs (need to spend one) and 500 substats for 5 fullness. Blows everything else out of the water... if you were already in hobopolis. --[[User:Drachefly|Drachefly]] 21:22, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
*Well, it's "Best Foods" and they aren't foods, they're adventures that use up fullness. Then again, why would that be so important, it does the same thing in the end. Pages say 60-80 adv, and 70/5 gives 14 avg though. --[[User:Fig bucket|Fig bucket]] 22:49, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
*One important difference is that they aren't affected by Got Milk et al; this page assumes that Got Milk adds 1 adv/full. --[[User:Campboy|Campboy]] 10:43, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

-

Can someone add the Rook Cookie, Bishop Cookie and Knight Cookie from the Red Queen's Garden to this list? - AvangionQ / November 2nd, 2010.

-

Can someone also add the Pumpkin Pie to the list? - AvangionQ / November 4th, 2010.

== January 9 Trivial Update ==

The tightening of adventure ranges for food shouldn't affect this table TOO much, if Jick & Co. did what I think they did... which is chop 1-2 adventures off the low and high end of a bunch of different foods (same amount on both ends), which doesn't affect the average at all. --[[User:Wrldwzrd89|Wrldwzrd89]] 23:36, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

-

Can someone also add Spaghetti con calaveras to the list? - AvangionQ / April 23rd, 2011.
*[[spaghetti con calaveras|It]] is still missing fullness. --[[User:Fig bucket|Fig bucket]] 14:27, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
*Heh, I'd actually marked it as 6, but didn't let the template know it was food.  The fullness should show up properly now.  --[[User:Starwed|Starwed]] 01:48, 24 April 2011 (UTC)

== Retitle or reimagine ==

Why does this page, called "Best Foods", bother to list foods that are no good?  Either it should be retitled, or should only list foods that might, at ''some'' point, be the best food available.  (That would be mean removing all crappy foods at the very least.)  At the very least, the existence of concrete in-game categories should be incorporated. --[[User:Starwed|Starwed]] 14:37, 2 May 2011 (UTC)
*In Bad Moon, sometimes crappy is as good as it gets.  And the page is structured more as a hierarchy, so you can see how good one food is relative to others.  If a food is missing, does that mean it's crappier than the rest, or that no one has bothered to add it in?  --[[User:Flargen|Flargen]] 15:42, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

== Revamp ==
*Similar to a proposed revamp of the Best Drinks page (see [[Talk:Best Drinks#Revamp|here]]), removing the tiers would leave space for including stats and a bad-moon field.  This is what it would look like.  Actually, it's a slight variation, not including a column for bad moon, but instead indicating bad moon availability through shading. --[[User:Fig bucket|Fig bucket]] 20:35, 3 July 2011 (CEST)
**An updated version.  This puts the bad moon column back in, and adds all foods in the [[:Category:Food (By Size)|Food by Fullness category]], except ones marked Unconfirmable. (Not sure if the s'mores should stay, they clutter it up a lot...) --[[User:Fig bucket|Fig bucket]] 20:08, 25 March 2012 (CEST)
**Finally, another update.  This version is based on extracting all foods in the food categories {crappy, decent, good, awesome, epic, beverages}. Let me know if there are errors, omissions, things that shouldn't be there. --[[User:Fig bucket|Fig bucket]] ([[User talk:Fig bucket|talk]]) 20:17, 2 November 2013 (UTC)
:(moved to actual page)

*I like this proposal - it looks nicer than the old table did, AND leaves room to accommodate new columns. --[[User:Wrldwzrd89|Wrldwzrd89]] 20:55, 3 July 2011 (CEST)

*Would it be a good idea to include a field for pvp fights in the above table? Currently there are very few pvp foods/drinks, and none of them give stats or advenutures. That could make a case for having them classed entirely seperately - how its currently dealt with on [[Best Spleen Items]]. I'm hesistant to add food and booze tables right now because its not clear the best place to put them, or if they should be included in revamped omnitables. If I wanted to add similar tables for food and booze to the wiki currently, the logical places would be [[Best Foods (PvP Fights)]] and [[Best Drinks#Best Drinks for PvP Fights]]. Alternatively, all three tables could go to [[Extra PvP Fights]] instead. [[User:Darkcodelagsniper|Darkcodelagsniper]] 00:40, 30 June 2012 (CEST)
** I wouldn't list food that only grants more PvP fights on ''Best Foods '''(adventures)''''' at all. If someone is looking for more PvP fights he will do so in [[Extra PvP Fights]], which is a lot more compact. --[[User:Yatsufusa|Yatsufusa]] 12:27, 30 June 2012 (CEST)
*** I'm replying to the discussion on this page because it's linked on the Best Drinks page as the main place to discuss an overall revamp. The proposal being that this page be merged with ''Best Foods '''(stats)''''' and all food related bonuses are put into a single table, and to do similar for Drinks. That's why I thought it might be unwise to continue further splitting into different categories on different pages. In any event the revamp looks like its ground to a halt for now, so I'll follow your advice and add consumable tables to the Extra PvP Fights page. If a revamp does happen I think it'd be logical to also merge the extra pvp fight info. [[User:Darkcodelagsniper|Darkcodelagsniper]] 01:28, 3 July 2012 (CEST)
****"ground to a halt"?? It's just, uh, slow. :) But I do think that although PvP fight data could be added as a column, given the small number of items and specific goals, it would actually be better served on the Extra PvP Fights page. --[[User:Fig bucket|Fig bucket]] 01:35, 3 July 2012 (CEST)
* Should we add two more columns, 'Zone' and a Y/N field for 'is tradable'? That way it would be easier to tell quickly which of the foods you have access to. --[[User:Laa|Laa]] ([[User talk:Laa|talk]]) 01:42, 14 November 2015 (UTC)

==Bad Moon==
Is the BM column supposed to be Bad Moon? If so, it is filled with errors. There are several items marked N which are definitely available in BM (Bash-Os cereal for one) as well as many pasta dishes which require saucecrafting to make.--[[User:RogerMexico|RogerMexico]] ([[User talk:RogerMexico|talk]]) 13:04, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
*Yes.  The table is generated by crawling the wiki for food items, with status in the BM column determined by whether a food is listed on [[Bad Moon Food and Drinks|this page]] or not.  I (hopefully) fixed Bash-Ōs cereal, which likely failed to be recognized because of the accented character.  Many others may indeed be missing.  You can change fix things on this page, but please (also or instead) add them to [[Bad Moon Food and Drinks|the list]] and then it'll be corrected in future regenerations as well. --[[User:Fig bucket|Fig bucket]] ([[User talk:Fig bucket|talk]]) 20:58, 11 February 2014 (UTC)
**saucy noodles are still listed as bad moon accessible and still impossible to make. --[[User:Evilkolbot|Evilkolbot]] ([[User talk:Evilkolbot|talk]]) 09:17, 9 January 2020 (UTC)

==Dark Gyffte food (and booze)==
I notice that Jarlsberg-specific consumables are listed here, despite that they cannot be consumed by anyone else. It is a bit odd, but it doesn't affect anything.

However, Dark Gyffte food/booze gives an obscene number of adventures in comparison (up to 23 per fullness/drunkenness, versus 14/11 being the absolute best otherwise), and this is balanced entirely by Dark Gyffte's limited organ space. They would skew the results considerably, and would also likely confuse any newer players relying on this page as a reference. 

Should they be included with that in mind? If not, shouldn't Jarlsberg-only consumables also be removed?--[[User:Volc|Volc]] ([[User talk:Volc|talk]]) 21:25, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

== Should there be a standard flag? ==

(ditto on booze and spleen items)
Is there a reason there isn't a way to sort by standard / indicate which are standard? It would be very handy for new players that don't have a ton of IOTMs to know if a given item is something that they can pull or not. You can see in game if something is usable but it's a bit frustrating to go back and forth over and over trying to find which things will work and which won't. I didn't see any existing discussion here but I assume this has been discussed at some meta level already? {{unsigned|‎Random42}}

I wish to hell there was such a flag, and we could cause the list to exclude/include out of standard items.  As it is now, these "best" lists are practically useless, at least for Path of a Plumber, where food stats, now sortable in the table, are more important.--[[User:Arkcon|Arkcon]] ([[User talk:Arkcon|talk]]) 15:03, 8 March 2020 (UTC)
* I added a column with a Y/N for standard availability.  First attempt; let me know if anything is broken.  If it seems ok I can try that for booze too...  --[[User:Fig bucket|Fig bucket]] ([[User talk:Fig bucket|talk]]) 21:06, 10 March 2020 (UTC)
**I tried it out, and it is very nice -- sorting on one, then the other gives me a list I can use during Path of the Plumber.  This could be the start of something awesome, but its pretty useful just the way it is,--[[User:Arkcon|Arkcon]] ([[User talk:Arkcon|talk]]) 23:58, 10 March 2020 (UTC)
** Works great! Three thumbs up! --[[User:Random42|Random42]] ([[User talk:Random42|talk]]) 09:05, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

It occurs to me that instead of Std a Ronin flag might be more useful? Even if it is available in Std, we can't eat level 13+ in ronin right? Once ronin is gone though we no longer care about sorting for standard so ultimately we are really sorting for ronin to begin with. --[[User:Random42|Random42]] ([[User talk:Random42|talk]]) 11:53, 13 May 2020 (UTC)