Talk:Moons

How can we put that these are the only combonation of moons, no double full, or anything not shown? And do it with a nice deminer?--Fly boy42 21:47, 16 March 2006 (CST)

Grimace's observatory text implies that this is the start of a new event/story:

One of the astronomers nods, smiling. "I see you've found Grimace, one of our two moons. Due to its influence on magical energy, ancient scholars called it Magicus Gluteus, or 'The Wizard's Moon'. They also predicted that some sort of terrible catastrophe would befall it..." He turns to look at a calendar. "Well, any day now, actually. But naturally that's a load of rubbish. What could possibly happen?"

In this light I think we should have seperate pages for Ronald and Grimace and each one's unique history (as well as observatory images). --NewZorkBat 11:50, 15 May 2006 (CDT)

A comet seen in the moons "bar" area

As of 7:45AM Eastern Time on Friday, May 26th (Petember 3rd), I saw a comet in the same "bar" area as the moons (next to the Asymmetric Publications copyright notice). I think this represents that in a few days (best guess) one or both moons will be struck by this comet and have their behavior altered, as I think was suggested in a J&S discussion. The comet itself is linked to the Observatory, so this discussion could be moved to that page as well. - Eevle (#76998)

The comet's effect on moon patterns

As of June 3rd, a comet has struck Grimace, leaving a small hole. This may have caused the patterns of Grimace to change. We need someone to see if the stat days have been affected. If not, please tell me, so I can remove the needs work bar. --StrongbadfanEX 08:25, 3 June 2006 (CDT)

• What we know:
  1. Currently, Temporary Lycanthropy gives -50%. That means that with the moons being as they are today, it counts the same as if it was . The white section with the black hole counts as a black section. The black sections with white holes probably count as white sections. Presumably the Talisman of Baio and the Jekyllin hide belt are similarly affected.
• What we won't know without further information (and will be mostly revealed in time if we just watch the sky):
  1. Whether Grimace's phases happen at a different speed now.
  2. How and when becomes .
  3. Whether the hole is actually a hole in Grimace, or a piece of the comet orbiting it. It is infact a moonlet due to grimace of june 4.
  4. Whether Grimace== counts as a Muscle day rather than .
  5. If #4 is yes, how this affects Moxie days.
• My gueses are: "No", "Some pattern that doesn't line up with the months (like every 3/5 days, or something)", "Piece of the comet", "Yes", and "Something complicated", respectively. Having #2 not line up with the months will make stat days reasonably complex, without making Grimace have irregular phases (there are still only 8 images for it to go through, so to be regular it would still need a multiple of 8 days in its cycle... otherwise it would be like "2 days on this phase, then 1 on that phase..." which would just be bad... I'm pretty sure Jick said he wanted to avoid this, on the radio show when they were brainstorming about it). Phlip 08:42, 3 June 2006 (CDT)

Well, if Grimace hasen't been thrown off phase, the new table would look something like the one below. I'm posting it to see if it helps to visualize. I got rid of "resting" - assume it works as usual on stat days. (Speaking of stat days - today really seems like it should be a moxie day, doesn't it?) This table is just for visualization right now - we can add values later if it turns out to be useful. I wanted to compress it, so I used some abbreviations. bef=before and aft=after. Lycan=Temporary Lycanthropy. Baio=Talisman of Baio. Jek=Jekyllin Hide Belt. --LucySpace 16:44, 3 June 2006 (CDT)

Ronald	Grimace	StatDay bef	StatDay aft	Lycan bef	Lycan aft	Grue bef	Grue aft	Baio bef	Baio aft	Jek bef	Jek aft
			?	-75% Muscle	?	Attacks	?	+10% All Stats	?	+8 All Stats +20% Item Drops	?
				-25% Muscle	-50% Muscle	Attacks	Attacks	+30% All Stats	+20% All Stats	+6 All Stats +30% Item Drops	+7 All Stats +25% Item Drops
				No Effect	No Effect	Attacks	Attacks	+40% All Stats	+40% All Stats	+5 All Stats +35% Item Drops	+5 All Stats +35% Item Drops
		Mysticality	Mysticality	+50% Muscle	+75% Muscle	Does Not Attack	Does Not Attack	+60% All Stats	+70% All Stats	+3 All Stats +45% Item Drops	+2 All Stats +50% Item Drops
				+25% Muscle	+25% Muscle	Does Not Attack	Attacks	+50% All Stats	+50% All Stats	+4 All Stats +40% Item Drops	+4 All Stats +40% Item Drops
			?	+25% Muscle	+50% Muscle	Does Not Attack	Does Not Attack	+50% All Stats	+60% All Stats	+4 All Stats +40% Item Drops	+3 All Stats +45% Item Drops
			?	No Effect	?	Attacks	?	+40% All Stats	?	+5 All Stats +35% Item Drops	?
		Muscle	?	No Effect	?	Attacks	?	+40% All Stats	?	+5 All Stats +35% Item Drops	?
		Muscle	?	+25% Muscle	?	Does Not Attack	?	+50% All Stats	?	+4 All Stats +40% Item Drops	?
			?	+25% Muscle	?	Does Not Attack	?	+50% All Stats	?	+4 All Stats +40% Item Drops	?
			?	+50% Muscle	?	Does Not Attack	?	+60% All Stats	?	+3 All Stats +45% Item Drops	?
		Mysticality	?	+50% Muscle	?	Does Not Attack	?	+60% All Stats	?	+3 All Stats +45% Item Drops	?
			?	+25% Muscle	?	Does Not Attack	?	+50% All Stats	?	+4 All Stats +40% Item Drops	?
			?	-25% Muscle	?	Attacks	?	+30% All Stats	?	+6 All Stats +30% Item Drops	?
		Moxie	?	-50% Muscle	?	Attacks	?	+20% All Stats	?	+7 All Stats +25% Item Drops	?
		Moxie	?	-100% Muscle	?	Attacks	?	No Effect	?	+9 All Stats +15% Item Drops	?
			?	-75% Muscle	?	Attacks	?	+10% All Stats	?	+8 All Stats +20% Item Drops	?

Okay, I changed the table to reflect the normal moon phases. We can update them later or change them around according to the minimoon. --LucySpace 00:50, 4 June 2006 (CDT) Below I've put my new predictions for the moons. I assumed an elliptical orbit with Ronald and Grimace as foci. If you think otherwise, please post new predictions. The big problem with my predictions is that it does not include predictions on when the minimoon appears on the outside edge of the moon. That bothers me. --LucySpace 01:19, 4 June 2006 (CDT)

Ronald	Grimace

I think what will happen is that the moon will have an orbit going back and forth, but turning white to black every so often. I think seeing how the next two days work will make a lot of this confusion clear. Otherwise the minimoon.gif (which is a white mini moon) becomes useless. and I was making this table on my own, but I'll just help with this one now. Much easier for me.

Also, I've a pic of the moons before rollover when the comet hit. They looked like this: What it looks to me is that the moon will move across the moons, and perhaps moving from Ronald to Grimace changes its color. Picture is on Noodlebandit's wordpress page if you want to go see it yourself. --Ashallond 09:09, 4 June 2006 (CDT)

So the thing we need to remember is that these are orbiting moons, not rotating objects next to one another. Hamburglar is orbiting Grimace. Not Ronald and Grimace. I'm currently working out images to show the positions of the moons around whatever planet the Kingdom is on, and will see where that takes me, given the images of the moons with Hamburglar from the last couple days. --Shaft1986 (signature pending)

• Fantastic, Ashallond! I added it to the table. Thanks for the heads up. Hm, you think it might change color when changing moons? I just assumed it did that because either it was a drawing and we wouldn't be able to see it if it was black on black or because celestial objects look light when viewed alone but look dark when eclipsing a bigger object with greater luminosity. The next few days will be interesting. --LucySpace 14:31, 4 June 2006 (CDT)

• Possibly. but there is a version of each phase with a white and black moon in front of it, so I think it might be a rotation around *off to the right and then back from the left or right, weaves left then back right like some oscillation* but every time that it goes from Ronald to grimace it might change. tomorrow will tell me a lot about what I think the attern will be, but I doubt that the third moon will ever be off the baord. --Ashallond 16:20, 4 June 2006 (CDT)

• • That's an interesting theory. I really hope there's no weird retrograde motion. You don't think Hamburglar will ever disappear behind the moons? --LucySpace 17:54, 4 June 2006 (CDT)

• • Possibly. I can see an oscillation pattern or a loop around (front and behind) both moons in my head. I really need to see where the moonlet goes for a day or two more. once we get enough data points to extrapolate the pattern, we can knock this thing out fairly quickly. **EDIT** um...never mind this one just threw me for a loop. --Ashallond 22:56, 4 June 2006 (CDT)

• Well, with today's info narrows everything down about the moons from a given position, save stat days...
  • Count one for each quarter of each moon's surface that's white (like we used to).
  • Subtract one if a black Hamburglar is occluding a white piece of larger moon (but not if it's just a black Hamburglar elsewere).
  • Add one for a white Hamburglar, either in front of a black piece (probably) or elsewhere.
  • Take the total to be out of 8.
• Which makes sense, since the effects are basically based on the amount of light we get from the moons... now we just need to know their exact movements, their effects on the stat days, and what determines whether Hamburglar's lit when it's not over a moon. Phlip 23:37, 4 June 2006 (CDT)

• • • Who on earth named the little moonlet hamburglar?--SomeStranger (T | C) 12:56, 5 June 2006 (CDT)
      • Riff said [here] that the dev team had taken to calling it Hamburglar. --DataVortex 13:20, 5 June 2006 (CDT)
        • um, ronald and grimace are pre-existing terms, but hamburglar is a coinage. those evil arch people will surely slap some C&D's on our very sorry arses if we insist on using this. we're no morgan spurlock. --Evilkolbot 13:29, 5 June 2006 (CDT)

Updated the baio info for today. J&S said last night they need to come up with a generic name that still fits in the theme, but not a copyrighted name. We also need to sort out the pattern of the moonlet. --Ashallond 13:29, 5 June 2006 (CDT)

• Why, in the big chart, does the first day have a picture of Ronald with a white version of the moonlet. I don't seem to remember it being there.--SomeStranger (T | C) 16:15, 6 June 2006 (CDT)

• • It appeared after the emergency maintenance but before the nightly maintenance. Perhaps you didn't log in during that time? Here is a screenshot. See above where Ashallond mentions, "Also, I've a pic of the moons before rollover when the comet hit." --LucySpace 16:56, 6 June 2006 (CDT)
    • I see now, I wonder why it changed...--SomeStranger (T | C) 18:23, 6 June 2006 (CDT)

• • I think the mini moon has 16 possible positions, but moves 3 spaces at once. There are 8 spots infront of the big moons, and 8 spots behind the big moons. 4 of the 8 "behind" locations will show through, because they are on the sides of the moon. The entire cycle of the minimoon would repeat every 16 days, leaving many of the possible images unused though. --User:Ark42

• Possible. I'm of a theory that it's a 12 day cycle. If a 16 day cycle was used it would mirror with Grimace, not giving the variety that Jick wanted to redo the moons. 12 gives some interesting combo opportunities with 8,12,16 having tons of common multiples. Anyway, on another note. I'm starting to suspect that the moonlet phase pattern is two days white, two days black, two days white, etc. Baio info for today updated. --Ashallond 23:43, 6 June 2006 (CDT)