Talk:Intriguing puzzle box
In so far as I am aware this item can be found upon beating Riff's butt. Description of item:
intriguing puzzle box
There doesn't seem to be any obvious way to open this glossy black lacquer cube, but there does appear to be some kind of mechanism inside it that allows the faces to be pushed and rotated. A faint rattle from within indicates that a small object is hidden inside, but...
Type: usable Selling Price: 23 Meat.
Plural = Intriguing puzzle box
Eliza mira 04:29, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
As far as I know - which isn't much - Riff's butt drops the intriguing puzzle box, and Jick's butt drops the handful of numbers. --TheNachomancer 04:39, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
When you press faces, turn them ect it makes a noise like click, beep or gives out a number (I've had 5,9,11,16 and a couple of others) Eliza mira 04:48, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
- I have figured out how the cube give is't answers, now I just have to figure out if i should make the numbers appear in some special order (I have 1,2,4,5,7,10,12,13,14,18, will try going up or down but if someone has a clever idea...) --Christog 09:27, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
- Hmm, I just sent this to my multi and he got other numbers and systems so I guess it is randomized per player. I also guess it has no solution so I will describe how I "solved" it:
You have a counter that increases for every [number,click,beep] and resets on harsh buzzing noise or after 32 combinations of [number,click,beep] (which is followed by a noise for all buttons).
If anyone wants to see if there is a fixed number of cubes, here is my cube: [1] --Christog 10:13, 1 April 2011 (UTC) - My cube actually passed 32 iterations and goes to at least 35. (still in the process of testing. -- Serin
- Past 80 iterations here, no change w/ Single-Eyed Vision added. -- Skittius
- Did some spading not getting anywhere fast, things I did determine. 1) the starting point is the starting point. 2) BUZZ always reverts you to your starting point. 3) the options always give you the same result and the same set of options. These 3 tell me it is mappable. 4) there are 6 faces (top, bottom, left, right, front back) and 3 operators per face (push, turn clockwise, turn counterclockiwise) 5) The same face and operator combination can result in multiple numbers being given. 6) It may not be possible to get a number each time. --Uzziah 22:59, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
- I have charted all the possible choices from my first 96 phases of the Box and figured to share my findings. 1.) No matter what action you take if it doesn't buzz the next set of options will always be the same each time through. I.E., first step you push left, it clicks, and you get second set, or first step you rotate right counterclockwise, it beeps, and you reach the second set. 2.) When it speaks numbers it only says 1-18. Also, in any given set of options number speaking is often near each other. I.E. option 1 says 3, option 2 will likely say 3 as well. This seems to happen 2/3 of the time. 3.) Buzzing also seems to behave this way, 2/3 of the time if option 1 is buzz, option 2 will be as well. 4.) I have reached the 102nd phase. So it doesn't end at 100. 5.) Some phases will have no options that buzz, some will have no clicks, some have no numbers, some have nothing but clicks, some have nothing but buzzes, it might just be gibberish to distract people from trying to progress as far as they can without it buzzing.
At first I thought when single numbers were spoken they were the "right" choice to do at the phase of the puzzle. Then I found that some single numbers were spoken a second time later and that other single numbers related to actions that are unavailable on that numbered phase. I have discovered no obvious pattern to whether an action is tied to buzzes, clicks, numbers, or beeps. Sometimes a spoken number for an action will be repeated for that same action later. Thus far the only solid thing I have is that the puzzle is consistent each time you're buzzed. My current theory is that the spoken numbers actually tell you which choice is incorrect for that numbered phase and that we need to collect enough numbers to rule out all but one choice from each of the first 18 phases. Just a theory though. --Lady Luck Fortuna 23:26, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
The option that the numbered phases indicate a path sounds good, but what about users like Christog? From his spreadsheet it looks like he doesn't have enough phases to indicate what the correct path would be. I've got 54 of the 90 possible spots mapped for a potential initial 18 path already, and the fact I'm seeing repeats of numbers in the same phase position is making me wonder. ::Laugh:: Need to figure out how to automate the input of the knowns, the list is getting too long. --Skittius 17:34, 10 April 2011 (EST)
Every time that I moved everything clockwise, apart from the left bit, it would take me to a page that said, clockwise for left and anti clock wise for everything else. But every option would make it buzz. Can't figure this darn thing out.
--Smiling Spectre 22:14, 3 April 2011 (UTC)--- Well, as it seems there is no advencement here, I will post my viewing of this:
1. There is nothing visually changed for any selecting options except "buzz". I.e., it's means nothing, if I'll select first, second or third option, if I heard "click", "beep" or number - it will be next stage, except buzz, that resets cube to position 1. And it is truly one "next stage", it have the same set of options and outcomes, regardless of path. For example, if on step 4 I heard "3" on option 1 once - I will hear this "3" always on this step, and it is no matters, if it was selected 1-2-3 for my previous steps, 4-1-5 or 6-6-6. And yes, other choices remains the same too, so if option 5 on turn 6 gave me buzzing one time, it will be buzzing each time, no matters what way I used to reach it. Taking this approach, your "seeming" actions not means anything at all, only "buzz" matters.
2. So it looks like solvable, one-way corridor. But I am went so far as step 110 - and nothing changed. There is every new combination with each step, so there is no infinite loop. On the other hand, there is no any advancement either.
Conclusion: so there is possible one of several outcomes:
1. There _is_ some end with such advancement, and it is simply too far to prevent "occasional" revealing.
2. The end of puzzle depends on something else. For example, it scales for people main stat or uses turn counter.
3. There is solve, but it haven't anything with seeming "advancement". Like in most of "Monkey Island" games, where you can "progress" in it's mazes, but there is simply no exit for "non-guided" run.
3.1. Numbers actually means something, and you need to hit it in some order, or you must hit _something else_, using this numbers to advance.
3.2. Numbers means nothing, and you need another April item to uncover true path. As Atomic Comic already was tested, it can be Red Pill. Or both Comic and Pill.
4. There is no any solution at all, because such "self-generating" way with 3 actions and 6 positions can have 18^6 different combinations, that making it virtually not looped for human life. :) But I am, personally, don't want to believe in it. Especially after Obnoxious riddle. :) --Smiling Spectre 22:14, 3 April 2011 (UTC)
Man, I was so sure that the solution was to get the box to say the five "random numbers" (divided by 5, so 1, 2, 5, 9 and 12), possibly in some order. But I've been mapping out my box and it doesn't say 1 until phase 49, but at phase 47 I am forced to make it say 11 or buzz.
Is there something else it could be spelling out or doing? I'm sure the solution (if there is one) must be to make it say something specific. --Parmeisan 21:36, 5 April 2011 (UTC)
---Smiling Spectre 11:05, 29 September 2011 (CEST)--- I checked version "press all numbers in any order". Well, after pressing all 18 numbers, it's still nothing. Pity. ---Smiling Spectre 11:05, 29 September 2011 (CEST)
Consumed on use?
Are these consumed on use? Or can they be reused? --JRSiebz (☎|§|‡) 02:27, 2 April 2011 (UTC)
- It can be attempted multiple times, that is for sure. As for reuse probably not, assuming that it does in fact have a solution and isn't an Admiral Ackbar's Spader Box. --Skittius 12:49, 2 April 2011 (EST)
The Morrowind Reference
Pulled it. Beyond the fact that they are both puzzles boxes, I don't see any other connection...certainly not in terms of the description of the box or any of the options.--Foggy 14:37, 2 April 2011 (UTC)
- "bloodmore"? single edit. hmm. uncle riff's sock puppet giving us a clue, maybe? --Evilkolbot 20:53, 3 April 2011 (UTC)
- watching this the puzzle box isn't even a real item, just a token to be handed in to complete a quest. so, who would want it? --Evilkolbot 21:04, 6 April 2011 (UTC)
Abort, Retry, Coerce with Hammer
Wondering, has anyone tried to pulverize it yet? Is it even an available option? --Skittius 22:55, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
- LoL, just remembered Smashbot, and it seems it doesn't malus or pulverise. --Skittius 23:00, 7 April 2011 (UTC)
I did try forcing it using the URL directly, no luck. --Starwed 15:11, 8 April 2011 (UTC)
Took a shot, can't Zap it either... --Skittius 05:49, 23 April 2011 (UTC)
In case anyone wants to try working again...
I haven't seen anyone bring up the likelihood that it is an 18-character code phrase.
No one has seen a number greater than 18. The most likely thing I can think of, given that, is that something about either the positioning or, more likely, total frequency of each number gives net information about the letter at the position of the phrase indicated by the number.
For example, if 1 appeared 20 times and 2 appeared 14 times, perhaps there is an easily- breakable cipher started with "tn...". My first attempts at breaking it would be to apply rot1-25, if no number appears more than 26 times (even the data sheet I've seen that has the greatest number of rows filled out, here, does not have more than 20 or so of any number). After that, I'd apply a different rot based on each index count, in increasing or decreasing order from the left.
This can only be done by someone writing a script (I... don't know how, but someone must. I heard about a python script that works on kolmafia?) to find every single result for all choices up until they hit a row where all 6 results are "buzz" (I heard someone reached this row around 210, but there was another person that reached 260 without hitting this row?), and store them in memory (it's O(n) storage, O(n^2) time to map them all). Even if the decipher attempts mentioned in the previous paragraph don't work, if 2 people ran this script to completion (it should take less than a day unless kol was being suuuper laggy?), we could plot out a geometric relation between numbers at particular indices.
Personally, I think everyone gave up too easily just because this puzzle wasn't from the butt of the dev that's known for puzzles. --HikaruYami (talk) 02:06, 7 April 2013 (UTC)
Trust me, giving up wasn't easy. I can't speak for anyone else, but I finally just reached a brick wall. Lost all the data I had saved a couple of HD crashes ago, but when I get some time I'll drag one out and play with it a little more. Heh, on a side note, I still randomly send one to Riff in a gift box with a snarky message. I just like to remind him that the war with his puzzle box never ended for some of us. Skittius (talk) 05:18, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
Things have changed
Previous documented attempts indicate that actions are 'paired' so that each action does the same thing as the action directly above or below it. That is no longer the case. I mapped one out to 300 states, and managed to make the box count up from 1 to 18 and speak no other numbers. Nada. I'm undergoing a project to map out a cube to 50 states with every ascension. Message me in-game if you'd like to participate. Eventually I hope to have enough statistics to determine whether or not the 'puzzle' is just random output. --Sausssage (talk) 22:36, 11 November 2014 (UTC)
