Talk:Headbutt
I think it's based on your power, because I was using it, then I used an increase damage buff and the damage went up (without a helmet) ----Hamelin 00:13, 21 Aug 2005 (Central Daylight Time)
With 61 buffed Muscle, I was doing 1 damage with no helmet, and 6-8 with a regular helmet turtle. With an Elder Turtle Shell, putting me at 68 buffed Muscle, damage was ranging between 16-35 but usually falling within 17-20. Out of 15 samples, damage of 35 only appeared twice, so I'm guessing that critical hits can happen with headbutts, even though there was no feedback about a critical.
Landing a critical hit with your weapon doesn't seem to affect headbutt damage.
Should have enough moxie (and access to the mines or mall) within the next 2 days to test asbestos and linoleum turtles.
- V
With a chrome helmet turtle and 124 muscle I see between 27 and 39 damage from a headbutt (plus the damage from my regular attack, it is pretty good). --Club 14:06, 31 Aug 2005 (Central Daylight Time)
Does anyone know if the Stainless Steel Skullcap and Plexiglass Pith Helmet count as turtles?--Zaku 12:03, 25 Sep 2005 (MDT)
From what I have heard they count as turtles --NitraMo 12:23, 25 Sep 2005 (MDT)
Little bit surprising, I know. But the wolf mask also seems to increase headbutt damage, at least from what I've seen... --Tenebrys 01:26, 11 December 2005 (Central Standard Time)
I used the headbutt with a star hat, and it always does 1 damage. Interesting.--Froggy7384 07:58, 14 March 2006 (CST)
Damage related to power of helmet?
I've read in the forums that the damage done is related to the Power of the helmet. Turtles get a bonus, maybe, but higher power == higher damage. (That's why a Wolf's Mask would do more damage, for instance.)
- The damage caused by Headbutt is definitely tied to helmet power. I did some tests with various helmets using a Level 17 TT, and came up with the following:
- bugbear beanie (30) - 5-7
- red traffic cone (60) - 6-12
- eXtreme scarf (100) - 11-17
- star hat (165) - 16-33
- helmet turtle (10) - 6-8
- meaty helmet turtle (70) - 8-13
- linoleum helmet turtle (100) - 25-34
- chrome helmet turtle (120) - 30-39
- The damage for non-turtle helmets seems to be within a range of (helmet power/10) to (helmet power/5). Turtle helmets are trickier. Oddly, the meaty helmet didn't seem to add any extra damage for me - the damage range seems consistent for a 70-power non-turtle helmet (Presumably, this is a bug). Aside from that, the small range indicated an absolute bonus rather than a percentage. My best guess right now is a bonus equal to (5 + (power/10)). If I'm right, the asbestos turtle helmet (which I haven't tested yet) should do 21-29 damage.--Discordia 18:26, 19 March 2006 (CST)
- The asbestos helmet turtle actually inflicts 23-31 damage with the above character. --Discordia 09:50, 20 March 2006 (CST)
- So far with a Wallaby TT wearing a stainless steel skullcap with Tao (effective power 180) has seen a range of 38-56 with a relatively low sample size; the range predicted by the above formulas would be 41-59. The actual size of the ranges seems to be correctly predicted, so I'd guess either the bonus damage from a helmet turtle of some nature is wrong (but the fact that it's constant is right), or there's something else throwing off the headbutt damage (+melee damage equipment or skills? I had none at all). Or maybe it's just changed. I'll pull some helmet turtles out after this run and play with this. --Araltaln 03:33, 3 October 2006 (CDT)
- Pith helm with Tao (effective power 360): 62-97 (very, very low sample size) rather than the predicted 77-113. --Araltaln 03:24, 10 October 2006 (CDT)
Hit percentage
Is it just me, or does hit percentage rise when using the Head + Knee Combo? --Mythril 11:17, 27 July 2006 (CDT)
Spading Out the Turtle Bonus
Right, throwing out old data just in case; the smaller ranges shouldn't be too hard to find in their entirety anyway. Still, I'll need a little help with the non-Tao ones at this point.
Feel free to simply adjust observed lows and highs when you see something more extreme. EXTREME! However, please only fill in the apparent bonus column when the observed range is equal in size to what the normal (non-turtle) damage range would be. --Araltaln 02:04, 11 October 2006 (CDT)
| Helmet Turtle | Power | normal low damage | normal high damage | observed low damage | observed high damage | apparent bonus |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| helmet turtle | 10 | 1 | 2 | 6 | 8 | |
| helmet turtle with Tao | 20 | 2 | 4 | 7 | 9 | 5 |
| Elder Turtle Shell | 50 | 5 | 10 | |||
| meaty helmet turtle | 70 | 7 | 14 | |||
| asbestos helmet turtle | 80 | 8 | 16 | |||
| stainless steel skullcap | 90 | 9 | 18 | |||
| linoleum helmet turtle | 100 | 10 | 20 | 33 | ||
| Elder Turtle Shell with Tao | 100 | 10 | 20 | 20 | 30 | 10 |
| chrome helmet turtle | 120 | 12 | 24 | |||
| meaty helmet turtle with Tao | 140 | 14 | 28 | 14 | 28 | 0 |
| asbestos helmet turtle with Tao | 160 | 16 | 32 | 31 | 47 | 15 |
| stainless steel skullcap with Tao | 180 | 18 | 36 | 38 | 56 | 20 |
| plexiglass pith helmet | 180 | 18 | 36 | |||
| linoleum helmet turtle with Tao | 200 | 20 | 40 | 35 | 55 | 15 |
| chrome helmet turtle with Tao | 240 | 24 | 48 | 39 | 63 | 25 |
| plexiglass pith helmet with Tao | 360 | 36 | 72 | 61 | 97 | 25 |
- I'd wager that it's possible to get 61 damage with plexiglass and Tao (and thus that the bonus damage is 25), but in a couple hundred adventures it hasn't come up. Similarly, I'd wager that Tao/no Tao won't affect bonus damage, although I can't personally confirm any of those numbers. Anyone? --Araltaln 02:27, 14 October 2006 (CDT)
- Hah, caught a 61. I guess I'll put the bonus damages on the main page and change (but not remove) the needsconfirm message. --Araltaln 16:37, 14 October 2006 (CDT)
- Good table, Araltan, and excellent work... except your math on the chrome helmet is off. Your numbers show a +15 bonus, not a +25 bonus, and this matched the results I just got on my main in HC. This is also testing without Tao, as my main doesn't have that HCP yet. I'll fix the chrome bonus and remove the needsconfirm on the main article, since my without Tao numbers match the with Tao numbers.--Salien 01:37, 5 December 2006 (CST)
Toy Space Helmet!
Anyone tried the new crimbo helmet with this skill yet? (tao or not) --Gregorio 04:35, 7 December 2006 (CST)
New Helmets?
Do the new helmet turtles acquired with the turtle pheromones increase damage from Headbutt? I'll add the names to the list on the article, but someone can remove it if it doesn't. --Coolguy00001 17:23, 17 January 2007 (CST)
- They do increase damage, although their damage ranges are strange...
- knobby helmet turtle 8-10 (with power 20, 2-4 damage without turtle effect, so it's +6 damage)
- skeletortoise 10-14 (power 30, 3-6 damage without turtle effects, which means +7-8 damage)
- furry green turtle 12-18 (power 45, 4-9 damage without turtle effects, so again it's +8-9 damage)
- If my calculations are correct, skeletortoise and furry green turtle contradict the formula
damage=[(power/10) to (power/5)]+ (constant turtle bonus)
--AlexCyrlex 08:55, 4 February 2007 (CST)
- As for bubblewrap bottlecap turtleban, it deals normal 7-14 damage, without any bonus. Probably that's because it is not just a turtle, but a turtle smithed with something (like meaty helmet turtle). I am updating both Headbutt and bubblewrap bottlecap turtleban pages to reflect this.--AlexCyrlex 09:44, 6 February 2007 (CST)
New, New Helmets?
Anyone know if the newer Turtle-related helmets also do extra damage?--Baby Disco Bear 03:11, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
Reference in Question
I do not believe the following reference to be relevant to the article. Can someone explain? --DataVortex 00:05, 14 February 2007 (CST)
- And the Police Department of Hubbard Township, Ohio seem to want to standardise the head butt -- only in America! In the UK, the head butt's comedy connection is via John Otway and Wild Willy Barrett's 1982 song Headbutts!, during live renditions of which Otway would head butt his microphone, risking physical injury but securing a sponsorship from Shure Microphones.
Some Bonus Updating
I had an opportunity to test this out with a turlte tamer with and without Tao (foggy2 does not have Tao, foggy4 does).
The recent infusion of new helmets apparently resulted in some fixes to various helmets. Meaty helmet turtles and bottlewrap turbans now have a bonus; the other helmets have been added.
I also added a note about doubling with Tao. I tested it with the irate sombrero for a non-turtle helmet...the +1 at the end is definitely weird, but it's there. --Foggy 16:24, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
Some damage numbers
Class Act II, Helm of the Scream Emperor (power 120), Glorious Blessing of the Storm Tortoise:
ML +30 108 (+95) 115 (+105) 106 (+97) 106 (+100) 106 (+97) 78 (+69) 106 (+97)
ML +45 71 (+57) 66 (+59) 58 (+52) 59 (+50) 68 (+60) 91 (+83) 88 (+80) 93 (+86) 92 (+84) 96 (+87) 87 (+82) 80 (+68) 65 (+56) 57 (+48) 72 (+67) 60 (+55) 74 (+65) 86 (+75) 64 (+56) 68 (+60) 70 (+64) 61 (+56) 92 (+84) 96 (+87) 62 (+54) 87 (+80) 44 (+40) (swarm of knob lice) 41 (+36) (swarm of knob lice) 58 (+54) (swarm of knob lice) 76 (+70) 67 (+55) 61 (+55) 43 (+40) (swarm of knob lice) 88 (+80) 72 (+64) 78 (+72) 72 (+66) 83 (+74) 63 (+56) 91 (+82) 78 (+72) 84 (+79) 85 (+76) 69 (+61) 68 (+60) 72 (+64) 64 (+56) 61 (+53)
--Hastifer (talk) 22:42, 22 November 2013 (UTC)
Spading Blessings of the Storm Tortoise Headbutt Damage
Normal Headbutt Damage is:
HelmetPower * (.1-.2) * Butts * Tao
Butts and Tao are 2 if you have those skills, otherwise 1.
Having Blessing of the Storm Tortoise causes the total damage range to be rolled twice and adds a base amount to helmet range.
With no Helmet, Blessing of the Storm Tortoise, Butts of Steel, and Tao of the Terrapin
Performs two instances of 5-10 physical damage (avg 15).
With no Helmet, Grand of the Storm Tortoise, Butts of Steel, and Tao of the Terrapin
Performs two instances of 10-15 physical damage (avg 25).
With no Helmet, Glorious of the Storm Tortoise, Butts of Steel, and Tao of the Terrapin
Performs two instances of 20-25 physical damage (avg 45).
I do not know if Butts and/or Tao effect the base damage given by the Storm Blessings as I had both for all spading.
The base ranges were determined with no helmet, no ML, and against giants.
Adding this to the normal formal, the Glorious of the Storm Tortoise buff would give:
((HelmetPower * (.1-.2) * 2 * 2) + (20-25)) * 2
With an orange peel helm (power 200) Damage range should be: 200-370. The experienced range after 20 or so fights was: 203-363.
--Eliteofdelete (talk) 06:01, 18 December 2015 (UTC)
